The Psychology of Yes: What a Behavioral Scientist Taught Me About Getting People to Buy

I hired her before I ever put her on the podcast.

That's how you know someone's the real deal. I don't bring people onto the New Wealth Movement just to fill a slot. I bring them because they have something my audience — and honestly, I — need to hear.

Dr. Kieva Hranchuk has a PhD in behavior analysis from Columbia University. She spent nearly two decades in a therapy room working with children with autism before she noticed something: the psychology of getting a client to act on what's good for them is the same psychology behind getting a buyer to say yes.

Now she helps entrepreneurs and corporations sell in a way that works with the buyer's brain — not against it.

This conversation cracked something open for me. And I think it will for you too. Here's what we covered.

What You'll Learn in This Episode

1. Relatability Is Costing You Sales

This one hit me hard. And I see it all the time.

People are told: "Be yourself. Be authentic. Be relatable." And so they go online and post about how tough sales have been lately, or how they're figuring things out, or how they're not quite where they want to be yet.

And they wonder why no one's buying.

Here's what Dr. Kieva Hranchuk said that I want you to write on your mirror:

You can be relatable. Tell people you spill on your shirt every time you eat. Tell them you stayed up too late. But the moment you start posting about how sales are slow, how you're figuring out your offer, how you're still learning — you just friend-zoned your audience.

They like you. They just won't pay you.

When it comes to what you sell — own it completely. You're the expert. You're the authority. That's not arrogance. That's the identity your buyers need to see before they hand you their trust. This is what authentic sales leadership actually looks like.

2. Stop Selling ROI. Start Talking About COI.

Everyone talks about return on investment. What can this coaching do for me? What's the upside? Show me the results.

But Dr. Kieva Hranchuk introduced something I think is even more powerful: COI — cost of inaction.

There's a moment in every sales conversation — a polarity shift. The prospect goes from guarded to open. From resistant to leaning in. And what creates that shift is when they finally realize: doing nothing is more expensive than moving forward.

You're not manipulating anyone. You're helping them see what they're already living. And once they see it, you become the obvious solution.

ROI gets people excited. COI gets people to act.

3. Pain and Desire — You Need Both

There's this narrative going around that pain-point marketing is wrong. That you shouldn't talk about what's hurting people. That it's manipulative or negative.

I disagree. And so does Dr. Kieva Hranchuk.

Pain is what stops the scroll. It's what makes someone feel seen. When you open a piece of content describing a specific, painful moment in their life — a symptom they're living with — they stop and think, "How does this person know?"

But you can't live in the pain. You walk them through it — and then you pivot to desire.

That's where you paint the picture. Show them the life on the other side. Introduce testimonials, proof, your own results. Future-pace them. Let them feel what it's like to have the problem solved.

I always tell my clients: imagine you're driving someone from point A to point B. They get out of the car at B. How do they feel? What does life look like? That's what you're selling.

Not the coaching. Not the program. The transformation at B. This is the foundation of selling in a way that actually feels good.

4. Scarcity and Urgency — Done Right

People can smell fake urgency from a mile away. The "buy by midnight or this offer disappears forever" energy? People know. They've seen it a thousand times. And it turns them off.

Dr. Kieva Hranchuk calls it positive scarcity and authentic urgency.

The difference? You give a real reason. "This closes Friday because we kick off Monday and I need to confirm who's in." "I'm capping this at 10 people because I don't spread myself thin — when you're inside, you get all of me."

Write that one down. That quote alone is worth the entire episode.

Urgency works because buyers have FOMO — that's real human behavior. But it has to be grounded in truth. Give them a legitimate reason, and the urgency serves them. Fake it, and you burn trust you spent months building.

5. Content Conditions. Conversations Convert.

This reframed the way I think about content entirely.

Your content isn't converting people — it's conditioning them. Like Pavlov's bell. Every post, every video, every podcast episode is slowly training your audience to associate your name with a certain feeling, a certain authority, a certain result.

By the time they reach out to you, they're already pre-sold. The conversation is where they cross the line.

That's why vanity metrics are a trap. My content that gets the fewest likes drives the most sales. Dr. Kieva Hranchuk said the same thing about her content. 800 views on a post — and she has nearly 40,000 followers. But those 800 people? Her people. The ones ready to move.

Keep showing up. Stay consistent. The conditioning compounds — even when the engagement doesn't.

6. Price and Trust Are Directly Linked

Here's something Dr. Kieva Hranchuk and I both see over and over: people undercharge, and then they wonder why their clients don't take the work seriously.

For a $33 product? Trust almost doesn't matter. People will take a shot. But when you're asking for multiple four or five figures, trust becomes everything.

The higher the price, the higher the emotional stakes for the buyer — and that means more trust, more proof, more process clarity is needed to get them to yes.

If you're listening to this: raise your prices. But show up to match them. The value has to be there. The access has to be real. And the support has to be genuine.

When people invest with me, they get me. That's not a selling point. That's a standard I hold myself to. And it's why people get results — and refer others.

7. Decision States — The One Behavioral Science Principle That Changes Everything

I asked Dr. Kieva Hranchuk: if you could teach every salesperson one thing from behavioral science — just one — what would it be?

Her answer was so clean I want to read it to you almost word for word.

Decision states.

You cannot sell a gallon of water to someone who just drank a gallon of water. It has nothing to do with your pitch, your offer, your charisma, or your closing technique. They simply don't want it. And no amount of pressure will change that.

But two hours later, they've been lying in the sun. Now they're thirsty. Now they want the water — and they'll come to you for it.

Your job in sales isn't to convince people who aren't ready. It's to understand what decision state your buyer is in — and meet them there. Nurture the ones who aren't thirsty yet. Sell to the ones who are.

In her upcoming book The Science of Yes, Dr. Kieva Hranchuk identifies six specific decision states buyers move through before they feel safe saying yes. This isn't a funnel. It's a map of the buyer's emotional and psychological journey — and when you understand it, you stop pitching too soon, stop burning leads, and start closing more with less pressure.

Follow her at @The_Yes_Scientist on Instagram and check out buyerbehaviorinc.com to get on the waitlist for the book.

The Identity Piece — Where It All Starts

Dr. Kieva Hranchuk said something at the end of our conversation that I want to land for you:

"People say yes in alignment with who they believe they are — or who they want to become."

This is everything I teach at samuelgegen.com. The revenue ceiling is an identity ceiling. Sales doesn't break down at the pitch — it breaks down at the identity level long before the conversation starts.

I think about my client Joey. After working with me, he hit his biggest month — $30,000. And I asked him later what shifted. He said, "Sam just convinced me I was a salesperson." He said it like it was the most obvious thing in the world. Matter-of-fact. No hesitation.

That identity shift — that's what unlocked everything else.

When I started in 2014, I was $100,000 in student loan debt making $36,000 a year. I walked into a sales job and asked: "Who's the number one seller here?" I found that person, watched them, learned from them, and asked myself: how does someone at that level show up? What do they do that I'm not doing?

Then I became that person. Not the version waiting to be knighted. Not the version waiting for permission. The version who decided — and showed up accordingly.

If you want your buyers to see themselves in your offer — you have to first see yourself as the person capable of delivering it. That's not mindset fluff. That's the foundation. Explore more on why your identity is your real revenue ceiling.

The Takeaway

If there's one thing I want you to walk away with from this episode, it's this:

You don't need better tactics. You need to understand your buyer better.

Know what decision state they're in. Speak to their pain, then their desire. Give them a real reason to act. Build the trust before you pitch. Own your authority without apology.

Selling isn't something you do to people. It's something you do for them. Dr. Kieva Hranchuk and I both live that. It's why people refer us out the ass, work with us again, and actually get results.

Go listen to the full episode. Then come find me.

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